COMMUNITY

This is why Tee it Forward is such a good idea. Just starting high school golf, I'm forced to play from the tips and will pretty much do that from now on even though I really don't want to. That means 14-18 year olds are playing 7000 yard golf courses. Doesn't sound right, or is it just me? They don't need anything over 7000, they just need to significantly narrow fairways and grow out the rough more. Put a premium on putting the ball in play.

Most courses have suggested tees based on your handicap. I try to stick to tees of at least 6000 yds. but not more than 6600. Any longer and I find myself taking 3 good shots to reach some longer par 4's. Also if I look at the scorecard and see par 3's of 230 to 240 yards, I just can't reach it unless I use driver. So I'll move forward to the next tees for the round. I don't carry a 3 wood. My max distance with my 19* hybrid is about 230.

Last time I checked golf courses had multiple tee boxes, didn't they?

Having said that difficulty is about more than length. A 230 yard carry over water may be no problem for Phil, but is frightening for many weekend golfers--especially if it is a fairway shot.

I've seen some courses (designed in the last 20 years) that have done a fabulous job of dialing down the difficulty level tee box to tee box. I've seen others that all they're doing is dropping off some yardage, and I've seen some that while decreasing the yardage have actually INCREASED the difficulty in other ways like creating a tee shot from the forward tees to a diagonal fairway.

I agree with Phil. But most golfers should play forward of the tees they play.

yes..

Phil is whining like a baby because that's what he does, and he's not very smart in this case ... there is well more than one tee box at that course. The starter isn't holding a gun to each member's head yelling at them to play the tips.

Plus, Stricker shot freaking 63!!! If Lefty spent more time playing golf and less time hitting driver 110% and firing at every pin, he might shoot 63 too.

When the pros go back to a 1988 golf ball, course designers will stop adding length to courses. But half those guys were hitting wedges into some of the par 4s that are 450-plus on Thursday. What's Rees Jones supposed to do?

I don't have a single problem with modern course design specifically because part of modern course design is to make sure every hole has 3-5 boxes, some even more. If a particular course is too hard, you have the right to keep moving up a box until you find a set of tees you can play. And if you can't find tees you can play, get lessons, read Hogan's five fundamentals and learn to golf your ball.

No it doesn't sound right. Like you and I discussed before when I was in Highschool (18-20 years ago) we played anywhere from 5600 to 6000 yds. Even in the state tournaments 6000 yds was about the max. 20 years ago equiptment was not like it is today though.

Another problem with most golfers today is just plain ego. When they go to a course instead of playing the tees that suit their game they end up playing the tips because someone else is playing them. Then instead of playing the course they try to play like the pros, what I mean is take the typical 550 yard par five. It is supposed to take three shots to get on the green, which should be fairly easy even if your tee shot is only 225. But nooooooo, everybody has to try for the green in two, end up over swinging the second shot or tee shot and get in trouble. Play the right tee box and play for par and stop blaming the course designers.

The man has multiple majors and 30+ wins i think i'll listen to what he has to say. Just because you have multiple tee boxes doesn't mean much depending on how far back you place them. Like Phil said if you put a 180 par 3 with water in front and bunker in back there's no place for the average golfer to bail out or error. I just think at some point modern designers are just trying to make a course as hard as they can instead of making a great course.

Seems like two different issues all mixed in together. Over extending course length for the pros is one aspect. I saw an interview with Bubba Watson yesterday who had the same question and thought that making the fairways more narrow and the rough longer would work better to keep scoring from getting out of hand.

As far as average golfers go, as noted by most comments here, we have tee box options available to fit our skill level. If you play the right set of tees, the overall length of the layout is less of an issue. I don't think courses are losing customers because they are to difficult to play. The economy is struggleing, discretionary income is reduced overall. Somebody is going to lose out. If I have to chose between playing a $100 course and paying the electric bill, I'ma start turning off lights and looking for a less upscale $30 course to play.

In more heavily populated urban/sub-urban areas in my neck of the asphalt jungle, real estate, taxes and development pressure combine to make keeping a couple hundred acres of golf course an iffy proposition.

Here's an idea to keep scores honest for the pro golfers. Make 'em play these...

The AAC is too long, right?

So how the hell is Scott Verplank in the lead? Scott Verplank, a man who can barely hit out of his own shadow compared to Phil, D.J., Bubba, et. al.?

When golf courses start using one box that forces everybody to play from 7,400 yards, then, yes, course designers have lost it. Until then, Phil and his fans can move up a few boxes and play it from 5,800 or whatever.

The ability to hit a golf ball is not a measure of your brain power. Plus, Phil's a whining baby. I prefer to take my advice from grownups.

a lot of people question the lengthening of courses so he isn't breaking new ground here. it's also funny that many of the ones doing well on this course are not long hitters. i think the layout of the course is great. people can't stop raving about the greens and those final four holes are a test and will make the finish very interesting.

I always get told to play the tips or a tee short of the tips (if it is a very long course) because of my distance. I wish they would get it through their thick heads that I am a 16 handicap. I have distance, yes. But, I do not have the consistency yet. Perfect example is a few days ago. I teed off with driver 3 times in a row. Had a low snap hook twice on the first tee alone (I had to hit 3 tee shots to have a ball in play..). After that they later said, well if we knew... and I was just sitting there saying yeah... IF you knew... When I hit it well, I can be the best out there that given day. But, when I have those days, well, it'll be somewhere in the 90s is all I can tell ya. If I didn't have a short game, I would have probably shot in the 110's. I just wish everyone would stop making everything about distance. when it comes down to it, I would rather have a 230 yard 3W down the middle to hit for my 2nd shot, than a 280 yard Driver that is in the woods, bushes, pine straw, etc. When I hit well, I play well. When I don't I don't. These architects to great with landscaping, but for goodness sake man, make it difficult by making it strategic, not about strength. Strategy is why Stricker, Bradley, etc. can shoot those low numbers. They don't hit it the furthest, but I will be damned if they aren't on the green more than anyone else. Totally agree with Phil. So what if there are 20 drivers (Dustin Johson, Bubba, etc.) on tour that can hit it 330 to 350 all the time barring downhill fairways. Some guys can hit 300, then there is someone like Corey Pavin at 250-260, or a Rocco Meddiate.

Corey, you have the right idea. When we dah the discussion before, there was a guy who couldn't break 110 and he felt that he should play the back tees because of his distance. I wish everyone would play it forward until they break par.